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	<title>Comments on: Doctor (Physician) Salaries &#8211; Not as High as You Think</title>
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		<title>By: Chinstrap</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-106608</link>
		<dc:creator>Chinstrap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 10:33:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>CaucasianAsian:
I am sure those examples do happen. I don&#039;t think it is as big a deal as one might think though.. One doctor of a doctor I know was on a plan and had this happen. His wife urged him to go up but he said no as he had been an Opthmologist for 25 years and his medical skills in all non-eye related areas were non-existent! Fortunately, there was a nurse on the flight who helped out. To that point, I guess nurses, firefighters, police are always theoretically on duty. For me, as a portfolio manager and value investor, I am always researching new companies, trends, as well. It becomes your life whether watching TV, at the shopping mall, or on vacation overseas - I am always looking for new ideas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CaucasianAsian:<br />
I am sure those examples do happen. I don&#8217;t think it is as big a deal as one might think though.. One doctor of a doctor I know was on a plan and had this happen. His wife urged him to go up but he said no as he had been an Opthmologist for 25 years and his medical skills in all non-eye related areas were non-existent! Fortunately, there was a nurse on the flight who helped out. To that point, I guess nurses, firefighters, police are always theoretically on duty. For me, as a portfolio manager and value investor, I am always researching new companies, trends, as well. It becomes your life whether watching TV, at the shopping mall, or on vacation overseas &#8211; I am always looking for new ideas.</p>
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		<title>By: CaucasianAsian</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-106606</link>
		<dc:creator>CaucasianAsian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 04:43:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-106606</guid>
		<description>Just thought I&#039;d throw this into the mix as a point of contention, but more importantly something to be considered: doctors should theoretically always be on duty.  That is to say that perhaps they are not overpaid.  Keep in mind that as a doctor one would not only have the knowledge of how to deal with emergency situations when such situations arise, but also the ethical and moral obligation to apply said knowledge.  Imagine, you are a doctor, you are &quot;overpaid&quot; at just say $200,000 pretax, post-overhead income, for arguments sake and simplicity, you board your flight to Hawaii for your Christmas vacation with the wife, kids, etc.  All of the sudden, someone starts choking on their bits and bites, heaven forbid, and someone cries out &quot;HELP!! IS ANYONE HERE A DOCTOR?&quot;.  Well there goes watching movies on those tiny annoying airline screens, you have suddenly found yourself back on duty.

Personally I have no actual anecdote to qualify the above, but I am sure it happens--how frequently, I cannot say.  Or even if you are a doctor, and out throwing away money at a nice fancy steakhouse and some gentlemen swallows his steak in the wrong way.  You get the idea.  I personally have never even fathomed the idea (until now) of an engineer having to pull a bridge (at least not usually as a spur of the moment thing, required quite promptly, or death my ensue) out of his ass when the surrounding society is instantaneously faced with a dilemma, but those &quot;is anyone here a doctor&quot; moments seem much more realistic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just thought I&#8217;d throw this into the mix as a point of contention, but more importantly something to be considered: doctors should theoretically always be on duty.  That is to say that perhaps they are not overpaid.  Keep in mind that as a doctor one would not only have the knowledge of how to deal with emergency situations when such situations arise, but also the ethical and moral obligation to apply said knowledge.  Imagine, you are a doctor, you are &#8220;overpaid&#8221; at just say $200,000 pretax, post-overhead income, for arguments sake and simplicity, you board your flight to Hawaii for your Christmas vacation with the wife, kids, etc.  All of the sudden, someone starts choking on their bits and bites, heaven forbid, and someone cries out &#8220;HELP!! IS ANYONE HERE A DOCTOR?&#8221;.  Well there goes watching movies on those tiny annoying airline screens, you have suddenly found yourself back on duty.</p>
<p>Personally I have no actual anecdote to qualify the above, but I am sure it happens&#8211;how frequently, I cannot say.  Or even if you are a doctor, and out throwing away money at a nice fancy steakhouse and some gentlemen swallows his steak in the wrong way.  You get the idea.  I personally have never even fathomed the idea (until now) of an engineer having to pull a bridge (at least not usually as a spur of the moment thing, required quite promptly, or death my ensue) out of his ass when the surrounding society is instantaneously faced with a dilemma, but those &#8220;is anyone here a doctor&#8221; moments seem much more realistic.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-106585</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 16:04:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-106585</guid>
		<description>Consider that nurses make $80 000 after 7 years.  With their benefits and pension that takes their salary well over $100 000.  They also get paid training.  Doctors also have no pensions or benefits, they have to buy that themselves.  They also have to maintain their education or they can&#039;t keep their license.  They also have to pay that on their own.  That makes most MD&#039;s a bargain considering the extra hours, responsibility, and stress.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Consider that nurses make $80 000 after 7 years.  With their benefits and pension that takes their salary well over $100 000.  They also get paid training.  Doctors also have no pensions or benefits, they have to buy that themselves.  They also have to maintain their education or they can&#8217;t keep their license.  They also have to pay that on their own.  That makes most MD&#8217;s a bargain considering the extra hours, responsibility, and stress.</p>
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		<title>By: Nystro</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-106205</link>
		<dc:creator>Nystro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Oct 2009 04:23:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-106205</guid>
		<description>The opportunity cost of lost income during all the years of training is high.  For me, it is the example of all my high school friends who are retired on pensions with great benefits, indexed to inflation.  They put in their 30 - 35 year requirement starting in their early 20&#039;s.  I started my job at 30.  Prior to that, as an intern and resident, in my day, we made very little (13K as intern), especially calculated by the hour!  
I am jealous of my friends wintering in Buenos Aires at 55!  Their 54K annual gauranteed and indexed pension with benefits....do they know how much they would have to put aside to fund that by themselves?  They would have to have 1 - 1.5 million aside.  So when people talk about salaries, I think it is very important to factor in these generous benefits and not just give the income number.  It doesn&#039;t tell the picture.  I am often taken aback by the number of people who think., somehow, doctors also will get pensions.  Well, we don&#039;t.  No pensions, no benefits.  Just sock it away!  I don&#039;t know many who could get their retirement together by 55.  Because doctors have high incomes in their earning years they can buy big houses, but that makes up a lot of their net worth.
My other point is that the idea that &quot;we are all equally meritorious&quot; is very Canadian.  We can&#039;t compare other professions simply because they have long training and study time.  Depending on the specialty, doctors really do take on tremendous responsabilities.  Just the fact that someone can suffer or die because of an error can be a stressful burden; then you add public humiliation when your malpractice suit is published in the local paper.  It makes for quite a stressful job.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The opportunity cost of lost income during all the years of training is high.  For me, it is the example of all my high school friends who are retired on pensions with great benefits, indexed to inflation.  They put in their 30 &#8211; 35 year requirement starting in their early 20&#8217;s.  I started my job at 30.  Prior to that, as an intern and resident, in my day, we made very little (13K as intern), especially calculated by the hour!<br />
I am jealous of my friends wintering in Buenos Aires at 55!  Their 54K annual gauranteed and indexed pension with benefits&#8230;.do they know how much they would have to put aside to fund that by themselves?  They would have to have 1 &#8211; 1.5 million aside.  So when people talk about salaries, I think it is very important to factor in these generous benefits and not just give the income number.  It doesn&#8217;t tell the picture.  I am often taken aback by the number of people who think., somehow, doctors also will get pensions.  Well, we don&#8217;t.  No pensions, no benefits.  Just sock it away!  I don&#8217;t know many who could get their retirement together by 55.  Because doctors have high incomes in their earning years they can buy big houses, but that makes up a lot of their net worth.<br />
My other point is that the idea that &#8220;we are all equally meritorious&#8221; is very Canadian.  We can&#8217;t compare other professions simply because they have long training and study time.  Depending on the specialty, doctors really do take on tremendous responsabilities.  Just the fact that someone can suffer or die because of an error can be a stressful burden; then you add public humiliation when your malpractice suit is published in the local paper.  It makes for quite a stressful job.</p>
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		<title>By: Chinstrap</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-105811</link>
		<dc:creator>Chinstrap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 18:00:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-105811</guid>
		<description>My spouse is a resident here in Toronto and we know many residents and practicing physicians. My comment is MDs now a days do make MORE than you think... The days of salary or billing caps are done.

Spouse worked in ski town north of TO. Family doc spouse worked with grossed $27k a month on 3.5 days a week work! Overhead is only $5k for her share of the building that all the docs OWN (ie paying herself). gov&#039;t chips in $$ for nurses, under Family Health Network.

ER docs at fee for service hospitals (Trillium Mississauga) or St. Josephs, can make $600k-$1 million. You start doing procedures during a night shift and rates are doubled. Note that a pretty full month is 20 - 8 hour shifts.

OB Gyne can make $400-$500 and most overhead covered by hospitals. A baby delivery is like $300 and doubles after midnight and more for a C section. One 24 hour call and a OB Gy can make $10,000. Not kidding.

Spouse just came back from rural health conference where rural town were recruiting. Number one point for Elliott Lake was family physicians can make $400k-$600k there with incentives.. 

Anyway, just shedding some light..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My spouse is a resident here in Toronto and we know many residents and practicing physicians. My comment is MDs now a days do make MORE than you think&#8230; The days of salary or billing caps are done.</p>
<p>Spouse worked in ski town north of TO. Family doc spouse worked with grossed $27k a month on 3.5 days a week work! Overhead is only $5k for her share of the building that all the docs OWN (ie paying herself). gov&#8217;t chips in $$ for nurses, under Family Health Network.</p>
<p>ER docs at fee for service hospitals (Trillium Mississauga) or St. Josephs, can make $600k-$1 million. You start doing procedures during a night shift and rates are doubled. Note that a pretty full month is 20 &#8211; 8 hour shifts.</p>
<p>OB Gyne can make $400-$500 and most overhead covered by hospitals. A baby delivery is like $300 and doubles after midnight and more for a C section. One 24 hour call and a OB Gy can make $10,000. Not kidding.</p>
<p>Spouse just came back from rural health conference where rural town were recruiting. Number one point for Elliott Lake was family physicians can make $400k-$600k there with incentives.. </p>
<p>Anyway, just shedding some light..</p>
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		<title>By: PD999</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-103135</link>
		<dc:creator>PD999</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 02:18:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-103135</guid>
		<description>Great debate. 
Does anyone know what a typical Canadian Radiologist earns? 
In the US, they are near the top of the tree (www.rsna.org), averaging over US$400/year!
Also, what is the Salary Cap in Canada? Maybe best to work part-time and still get a great salary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great debate.<br />
Does anyone know what a typical Canadian Radiologist earns?<br />
In the US, they are near the top of the tree (www.rsna.org), averaging over US$400/year!<br />
Also, what is the Salary Cap in Canada? Maybe best to work part-time and still get a great salary.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexander A. Jaramillo</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-100939</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexander A. Jaramillo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 03:46:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-100939</guid>
		<description>I agree that salaries of doctors for the most part are adequate, but not for specialists, who place themselves on a pedestal and assume the attitude of take or leave it.
The cost of liability as part of the total cost of any service related to health care has been a soar point for me for years. 
Not long ago, during a trip to Southern Spain, I developed a very severe pain in my back, then settled on the left side of my lower back. I went to a local clinic. One doctor, one assistant, two emergency beds, one computer; well, you get the picture. They asked me for a urine sample. Ten minutes later I was hooked to an IV. Twenty minutes later the pain was gone. Within 90 minutes I was out in the street, enjoying my trip as if the event had never happened. All for 87 Euros.
So, Why is it that the same thing in this country would have taken days, hospital stay, multiple tests, and several thousand dollars?
Liability. That is the short answer. 
We do need to change the health system in the US. But if the government does not find a way to reduce the cost of liability, we are still overlooking 40% or more of the total cost of Health care cost.
I do understand that the overhead of a doctor is greatly impacted by insurance coverage to himself.
What can the people of a democracy do to change this? Is there a means to raise this issue to an open debate? How can we get the media to address this topic more forcefully?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that salaries of doctors for the most part are adequate, but not for specialists, who place themselves on a pedestal and assume the attitude of take or leave it.<br />
The cost of liability as part of the total cost of any service related to health care has been a soar point for me for years.<br />
Not long ago, during a trip to Southern Spain, I developed a very severe pain in my back, then settled on the left side of my lower back. I went to a local clinic. One doctor, one assistant, two emergency beds, one computer; well, you get the picture. They asked me for a urine sample. Ten minutes later I was hooked to an IV. Twenty minutes later the pain was gone. Within 90 minutes I was out in the street, enjoying my trip as if the event had never happened. All for 87 Euros.<br />
So, Why is it that the same thing in this country would have taken days, hospital stay, multiple tests, and several thousand dollars?<br />
Liability. That is the short answer.<br />
We do need to change the health system in the US. But if the government does not find a way to reduce the cost of liability, we are still overlooking 40% or more of the total cost of Health care cost.<br />
I do understand that the overhead of a doctor is greatly impacted by insurance coverage to himself.<br />
What can the people of a democracy do to change this? Is there a means to raise this issue to an open debate? How can we get the media to address this topic more forcefully?</p>
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		<title>By: FrugalTrader</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-100017</link>
		<dc:creator>FrugalTrader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Aug 2009 11:51:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-100017</guid>
		<description>The chart is meant to show the amount of overhead that physicians face.  I&#039;m not sure where it is misleading?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The chart is meant to show the amount of overhead that physicians face.  I&#8217;m not sure where it is misleading?</p>
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		<title>By: health for all</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-99904</link>
		<dc:creator>health for all</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Aug 2009 22:06:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-99904</guid>
		<description>FT, correct me if I&#039;m wrong, but the comments I&#039;m reading show some misunderstanding which, I believe, stems from a misleading chart. The chart does not distinguish between earnings and billings. Neither is the same as income. A gross income of $250k is far more appealing than $250k in billings, from which you need to deduct rent, payroll, insurance, pay corporate taxes (if incorporated), etc., etc. With anyone not on payroll, earnings rarely equal income.
GPs gross about $155 (2005) as income. Internists typically wok at hospitals and their gross income is $310k. In one case earnings=billings and in the other earnings=gross income. So, if we compare apples to apples, there IS a huge difference between GPs and specialists.
In the barber example posted (an unusually successful barber, I might add), I suspect the poster meant $100K in billings, which may result in 60-70k gross income. The internist &quot;takes home&quot; $200+ after taxes, and the barber &quot;takes home&quot; $50k after tax.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FT, correct me if I&#8217;m wrong, but the comments I&#8217;m reading show some misunderstanding which, I believe, stems from a misleading chart. The chart does not distinguish between earnings and billings. Neither is the same as income. A gross income of $250k is far more appealing than $250k in billings, from which you need to deduct rent, payroll, insurance, pay corporate taxes (if incorporated), etc., etc. With anyone not on payroll, earnings rarely equal income.<br />
GPs gross about $155 (2005) as income. Internists typically wok at hospitals and their gross income is $310k. In one case earnings=billings and in the other earnings=gross income. So, if we compare apples to apples, there IS a huge difference between GPs and specialists.<br />
In the barber example posted (an unusually successful barber, I might add), I suspect the poster meant $100K in billings, which may result in 60-70k gross income. The internist &#8220;takes home&#8221; $200+ after taxes, and the barber &#8220;takes home&#8221; $50k after tax.</p>
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		<title>By: mike</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-98286</link>
		<dc:creator>mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Aug 2009 04:47:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-98286</guid>
		<description>How hard is it to make 400K as a doctor in canada. In the US its not hard in fields like cardiology and orthopedic surgery</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How hard is it to make 400K as a doctor in canada. In the US its not hard in fields like cardiology and orthopedic surgery</p>
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		<title>By: TK waste management</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-96910</link>
		<dc:creator>TK waste management</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 23:43:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-96910</guid>
		<description>I work for Waste Management in Canada, and a although I take out the trash, it&#039;s a darn important job.  If there weren&#039;t people taking out the trash think of how miserable people would be.  They would get sick. When I hear that doctors are getting over 100k salary, i find that ridiculous.  We work just as hard and have to work in dirty enviroments and dont get paid half that.  Doctors are way overpaid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I work for Waste Management in Canada, and a although I take out the trash, it&#8217;s a darn important job.  If there weren&#8217;t people taking out the trash think of how miserable people would be.  They would get sick. When I hear that doctors are getting over 100k salary, i find that ridiculous.  We work just as hard and have to work in dirty enviroments and dont get paid half that.  Doctors are way overpaid.</p>
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		<title>By: TK waste management</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-96909</link>
		<dc:creator>TK waste management</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 23:43:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-96909</guid>
		<description>I work for Waste Management in Canada, and a although I take out the trash, it&#039;s a darn important job.  If there weren&#039;t people taking out the trash think of how miserable people would be.  They would get sick. When I hear that doctors are getting over 100k salary, i find that ridiculous.  We work just as hard and have to work in dirty enviroments and dont get paid half that.  Doctors are way overpaid</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I work for Waste Management in Canada, and a although I take out the trash, it&#8217;s a darn important job.  If there weren&#8217;t people taking out the trash think of how miserable people would be.  They would get sick. When I hear that doctors are getting over 100k salary, i find that ridiculous.  We work just as hard and have to work in dirty enviroments and dont get paid half that.  Doctors are way overpaid</p>
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		<title>By: FrugalTrader</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-92751</link>
		<dc:creator>FrugalTrader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jul 2009 12:38:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-92751</guid>
		<description>Shawn,

Here is where the numbers came from:
http://www.nationalreviewofmedicine.com/issue/2006/10_15-30/3_PM_your_practice01_16.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shawn,</p>
<p>Here is where the numbers came from:<br />
<a href="http://www.nationalreviewofmedicine.com/issue/2006/10_15-30/3_PM_your_practice01_16.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nationalreviewofmedicine.com/issue/2006/10_15-30/3_PM_your_practice01_16.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Shawn</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-92687</link>
		<dc:creator>Shawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Jul 2009 18:32:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-92687</guid>
		<description>Can you provide a source for those overhead numbers?  They seem a bit high.


While expenses can vary widely among medical practices, the vast majority can look to some benchmarks for comparison purposes. According to the CMA’s Physician Resource Questionnaire1, overhead rates are reported as follows: family physicians, 36%; medical specialists, 25%; and surgical specialists, 33%. Support staff—typically a practice’s largest expense,—often comprise 40%–60% of total overhead costs. The full-time equivalent (FTE) number of support staff generally ranges from 1.00–1.25 for each FTE physician. Other benchmarks include occupancy costs, generally in the range of 20%–30%, with the remaining costs of medical and office supplies, professional fees, telephone, information technology (including computers, billing, scheduling, electronic medical records systems, etc.) also in the
range of 20%–30%2.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can you provide a source for those overhead numbers?  They seem a bit high.</p>
<p>While expenses can vary widely among medical practices, the vast majority can look to some benchmarks for comparison purposes. According to the CMA’s Physician Resource Questionnaire1, overhead rates are reported as follows: family physicians, 36%; medical specialists, 25%; and surgical specialists, 33%. Support staff—typically a practice’s largest expense,—often comprise 40%–60% of total overhead costs. The full-time equivalent (FTE) number of support staff generally ranges from 1.00–1.25 for each FTE physician. Other benchmarks include occupancy costs, generally in the range of 20%–30%, with the remaining costs of medical and office supplies, professional fees, telephone, information technology (including computers, billing, scheduling, electronic medical records systems, etc.) also in the<br />
range of 20%–30%2.</p>
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		<title>By: Shawn</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-92680</link>
		<dc:creator>Shawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Jul 2009 17:20:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-92680</guid>
		<description>In the United States, let the market determine physician salaries.  The cost of the US healthcare system is crippling the US economy.  We can&#039;t compete anymore with other countries where healthcare is like a subsidy to their businesses.  In the United States, the healthcare industry is not a free market, both the insurance companies and the AMA are gaming the system and keeping costs high.  Pre-existing conditions aren&#039;t covered and vast numbers of people are left with little or no insurance. I hope President Obama succeeds in his healthcare reform.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the United States, let the market determine physician salaries.  The cost of the US healthcare system is crippling the US economy.  We can&#8217;t compete anymore with other countries where healthcare is like a subsidy to their businesses.  In the United States, the healthcare industry is not a free market, both the insurance companies and the AMA are gaming the system and keeping costs high.  Pre-existing conditions aren&#8217;t covered and vast numbers of people are left with little or no insurance. I hope President Obama succeeds in his healthcare reform.</p>
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		<title>By: cannon_fodder</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-92656</link>
		<dc:creator>cannon_fodder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:28:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-92656</guid>
		<description>fanman72/Derek,

I know that the engineering curriculum in university was one of the toughest.  But, for my money, easily one of the most underpaid professions is a police officer in a big city.  When there is a very realistic chance you will be injured or even killed on the job, the stress on your family life, the lack of respect from the public... there aren&#039;t many jobs worse and only 1st Class Constables have a base pay greater than $70k in Vancouver (it takes you at least 4 years to achieve 1st Class).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>fanman72/Derek,</p>
<p>I know that the engineering curriculum in university was one of the toughest.  But, for my money, easily one of the most underpaid professions is a police officer in a big city.  When there is a very realistic chance you will be injured or even killed on the job, the stress on your family life, the lack of respect from the public&#8230; there aren&#8217;t many jobs worse and only 1st Class Constables have a base pay greater than $70k in Vancouver (it takes you at least 4 years to achieve 1st Class).</p>
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		<title>By: fanman72</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-92587</link>
		<dc:creator>fanman72</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Jul 2009 04:28:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-92587</guid>
		<description>Sorry guys but I have very little sympathy when I hear people complaining about their 155k &quot;net&quot; salary.  Yes we realize the sacrifices you make in your 20s but in terms of long term income, job security, and respect you guys have it good. 

I got my degree in chemical engineering several years back.  I&#039;ve been on both sides of it in terms of difficult of how difficult many pre-med courses are and the pure chem e aspect as i specialized in biomolecular engineering.  

I&#039;m looking at the six figure salaries listed here, and comparing it to my paycheck (65k/year) thinking what an absolute joke.  Our work is surprisingly boring - something I was unaware of before I graduated, there&#039;s absolutely no respect from society, very little knowledge on what we actually do for a living, and no understanding on the impact we make on people&#039;s lives.  People think products magically appear on the shelves at Wal Mart or Best Buy overnight.  People think clean water, cheap, abundant food, just &quot;happens&quot;.

The education is HARD, and our income doesn&#039;t reflect the difficulty of the curriculum.  I think the only people who have it worse are science academics who will never get tenure.


Time to look into other careers.  Unfortunately, many graduate schools are out of the option as my grades are shot to hell due to ridiculous deflated engineering curves.  

Maybe engineers and scientists in this country are ridiculously underpaid.  That being said, I&#039;m really curious how our financial crisis will play out.  I&#039;m not entirely surprised it happened as the emphasis in our country looks to have shifted from created and innovating products to moving money around and providing services.  20 years from now, I can&#039;t imagine the jobs making the big bucks now will be doing as well down the road like banking or law.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry guys but I have very little sympathy when I hear people complaining about their 155k &#8220;net&#8221; salary.  Yes we realize the sacrifices you make in your 20s but in terms of long term income, job security, and respect you guys have it good. </p>
<p>I got my degree in chemical engineering several years back.  I&#8217;ve been on both sides of it in terms of difficult of how difficult many pre-med courses are and the pure chem e aspect as i specialized in biomolecular engineering.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m looking at the six figure salaries listed here, and comparing it to my paycheck (65k/year) thinking what an absolute joke.  Our work is surprisingly boring &#8211; something I was unaware of before I graduated, there&#8217;s absolutely no respect from society, very little knowledge on what we actually do for a living, and no understanding on the impact we make on people&#8217;s lives.  People think products magically appear on the shelves at Wal Mart or Best Buy overnight.  People think clean water, cheap, abundant food, just &#8220;happens&#8221;.</p>
<p>The education is HARD, and our income doesn&#8217;t reflect the difficulty of the curriculum.  I think the only people who have it worse are science academics who will never get tenure.</p>
<p>Time to look into other careers.  Unfortunately, many graduate schools are out of the option as my grades are shot to hell due to ridiculous deflated engineering curves.  </p>
<p>Maybe engineers and scientists in this country are ridiculously underpaid.  That being said, I&#8217;m really curious how our financial crisis will play out.  I&#8217;m not entirely surprised it happened as the emphasis in our country looks to have shifted from created and innovating products to moving money around and providing services.  20 years from now, I can&#8217;t imagine the jobs making the big bucks now will be doing as well down the road like banking or law.</p>
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		<title>By: Derek</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-90208</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 17:43:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-90208</guid>
		<description>In general I&#039;ll agree with most here that doctor&#039;s certainly aren&#039;t overpaid when taking into account net income over theit lifetimes, however, mcfly&#039;s comments really irritate me.  It seems very few people realize how much of their life is affected by engineers.

The water your drinking...from a waste water treatment plant designed by an engineer.
The car your driving...desinged by an engineer.
Along a road and bridge...designed by an engineer.
To a home/apartment...designed by an engineer.
Where you&#039;ll sit at a chair (manufactured by a process designed by an engineer) while typing on your computer (designed and produced by engineers).

But of course those all just improve your life.  I mean you could live without anything produced in a factory (which is everything) as long as you had a doctor to take care of you, right?  Of course without engineers that cat scanner wouldn&#039;t be there, the isotopes required for tests wouldn&#039;t be available, and the pacemaker keeping the old ticker ticking wouldn&#039;t be around.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In general I&#8217;ll agree with most here that doctor&#8217;s certainly aren&#8217;t overpaid when taking into account net income over theit lifetimes, however, mcfly&#8217;s comments really irritate me.  It seems very few people realize how much of their life is affected by engineers.</p>
<p>The water your drinking&#8230;from a waste water treatment plant designed by an engineer.<br />
The car your driving&#8230;desinged by an engineer.<br />
Along a road and bridge&#8230;designed by an engineer.<br />
To a home/apartment&#8230;designed by an engineer.<br />
Where you&#8217;ll sit at a chair (manufactured by a process designed by an engineer) while typing on your computer (designed and produced by engineers).</p>
<p>But of course those all just improve your life.  I mean you could live without anything produced in a factory (which is everything) as long as you had a doctor to take care of you, right?  Of course without engineers that cat scanner wouldn&#8217;t be there, the isotopes required for tests wouldn&#8217;t be available, and the pacemaker keeping the old ticker ticking wouldn&#8217;t be around.</p>
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		<title>By: JQ</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-89387</link>
		<dc:creator>JQ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:54:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-89387</guid>
		<description>At: OntarioPhysician
&quot;salary IS related to the directness on the impact on someone’s life&quot;
I&#039;m sure acne clearing dermatologists are saving lives and Lasik docs are curing blindness with their $550/eye ads in every newspaper - its pretty obvious when all they can talk about is self-esteem and not needing to wear makeup (acne) or glasses (Lasik).  I know both of these specialties are very lucrative.  That pretty much debunks your rationale.  

Everything&#039;s a business, and how much you make is purely dependent on labor supply and service demand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At: OntarioPhysician<br />
&#8220;salary IS related to the directness on the impact on someone’s life&#8221;<br />
I&#8217;m sure acne clearing dermatologists are saving lives and Lasik docs are curing blindness with their $550/eye ads in every newspaper &#8211; its pretty obvious when all they can talk about is self-esteem and not needing to wear makeup (acne) or glasses (Lasik).  I know both of these specialties are very lucrative.  That pretty much debunks your rationale.  </p>
<p>Everything&#8217;s a business, and how much you make is purely dependent on labor supply and service demand.</p>
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		<title>By: JQ</title>
		<link>http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/doctor-salaries-not-as-high-as-you-think.htm/comment-page-2#comment-89385</link>
		<dc:creator>JQ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:45:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/?p=662#comment-89385</guid>
		<description>Everyone thinks they&#039;re underpaid, including hedge fund managers.  Find me people who honestly truly think they&#039;re overpaid and I&#039;ll find you flying monkeys.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everyone thinks they&#8217;re underpaid, including hedge fund managers.  Find me people who honestly truly think they&#8217;re overpaid and I&#8217;ll find you flying monkeys.</p>
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